Extinction Rebellion

[Scot Dutchy]

Greta a time traveller?

Greta Thunberg, time traveller? Girl in photo from 1898 resembles activist





Plenty of Scandinavians took part in the Gold-rush of course.

[pErvinalia]

I love when this sort of thing happens.

[JimC]

What were the good bits Jim? We're currently revising our Intro and Heading for Extinction talks to be a bit more sciencey and relevant to the local area. I'd be interested to know what you think works for you, and maybe what doesn't.

:thumbup:

The presenter, a Dr Christine Canty, is a Psychologist, and one of the first Victorian members. She has a great speaking voice, knows both the science and the XR principles well, and is very personable. We got a dozen newbies to our eastern suburbs group; a fairly conservative area, our group is relatively old, and hasn't got the numbers of the inner city groups, but we are growing...

[Sean Hayden]

Due to the size of my city, I estimate weekly participation in the protests, not including other factors besides driving, could add a full 2 extra tons of co2 to my yearly output.

I'll stay home, plant trees, and contribute to improving tech instead.

[JimC]

I always take the bus into the city when trying to smash the state, Sean...

[Sean Hayden]

That's not a realistic option here. Also, I doubt a detailed analysis will reveal I'm reducing emissions by taking half empty buses at odd times.

[JimC]

That's not a realistic option here. Also, I doubt a detailed analysis will reveal I'm reducing emissions by taking half empty buses at odd times.

If you change from a car trip to a bus trip, you will definitely reduce emissions. When a bus timetable exists, and you get on a half-empty bus, your weight is not going to increase its fuel consumption. I suppose that, if a bus service was generally running very crowded, then you getting a bus ticket might contribute to making the company add more buses to the route, but that is not going to be typical. There are moves to change to electric buses, re-charging from renewable sources, which would be excellent. Melbourne has electric trams, and our State Government has commissioned a solar farm to provide, on average, the power required for a year of trams...

[Sean Hayden]

I think the lower emissions from buses assumes they are carrying so many passengers. There is an optimal that takes into account many variables, and tweaking it changes their performance relative to cars. So, I can't just assume taking a bus is better.

We have electric options downtown, but where is that electricity coming from?

[Sean Hayden]

A motorcycle would probably be the best option.

[JimC]

I think the lower emissions from buses assumes they are carrying so many passengers. There is an optimal that takes into account many variables, and tweaking it changes their performance relative to cars. So, I can't just assume taking a bus is better.

On average, it is, particularly if the alternative of cars carrying only one or 2 people. Sure, I still drive when that seems the only alternative, but when I can, I walk or use public transport...

[Sean Hayden]

https://afdc.energy.gov/data/mobile/10311

This chart shows average per-passenger fuel economy of various modes of travel. All forms of rail achieve relatively high values because of high ridership and the energy efficiency of rail transport...

...Transit buses are not very efficient at their current ridership rates, where, on average, a given bus is less than 25% full.

[Svartalf]

where the frack did they get that data? For me to get a bus with available seats, I have to be in the VERY wee hours of the morning, or very late at night, and that's not even true for the whole line's itinerary...

[Brian Peacock]

Sean, I feel you're missing the point - a bit. Of course everything we do has some kind of impact, but we are not responsible for the climate and environmental crisis. What real choices did we or do we have about the kind of societies and/or economies in which we find ourselves embedded? However, we do have a choice about what we might or can do from this point on. Don't feel guilty about the effect on the environment driving your kids to school etc is having on the environment. Drive them to school and then try to think about ways to mitigating those effects over time, hopefully with the aim of reducing them to a manageable, sustainable level. That kind of work is possible, but if can only emerge from the needs of community can't it(?) - because those who have traditionally considered themselves the natual deciders for the community have consistently demonstrated that they just aren't up to the job, and probably never will be.

[Sean Hayden]

I don't think I'm missing the point. I merely stated that for me going to weekly protests could significantly increase my carbon footprint. I don't see that as any different than Greta choosing to take a boat rather than a plane so as to avoid her activism becoming a part of the problem.

[Sean Hayden]

Perhaps I'll project myself across the astral plane: there in spirit.