The Dawk on Bill Maher right NOW!

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Somebody round up a clip!!!

[Sisifo]

[charlou]

Thanks, Carlos

[angrychimp]

Maher+Dawkins=win

Thx for posting

[leo-rcc]

Somebody round up a clip!!!

I almost read that as "Someone unload a clip!!!"

[charlou]

Just posted this in the related thread over at RDF ... fits here, too ...


Janeane Garofalo was quite set on the idea that America and its foreign policy is responsible for causing Muslims to commit acts of terrorism. She's obviously either forgotten or unaware of the 2002 Muslim terrorist bombings of a Bali tourist nightclub district, killing 202 locals and international visitors, and injuring 240.

Bill Maher was talking about a form of guilt based hypocrisy (he flippantly, and rather insensitively, described as 'schizophrenia', but that's a different matter) whereby Muslims living in America indulge in all the freely available things the West has to offer, feel guilty for their decadence and turn that guilt into some sort of twisted combination of denial and vengeance, attacking the source of the temptation. Bill specifically named the kinds of temptation he was refering to and I'll say those are things Muslims would regard as 'sins of the flesh'.

Janeane argued that, no, it's foreign policy that is attracting Muslim extremist's attention, and cited the World Trade centre attack as her evidence, dismissing Western 'sins of the flesh' style temptation as not a plausible reason for terrorist attack because other more decadent cultures aren't attracting the attention of the terrorists. That's wrong. Bali's tourist nightclub district was attacked by Muslim terrorists for that very reason: decadent indulgence in 'sins of the flesh'.

If organised terrorists want to really hurt a big, arrogant, decadent, greedy, capitalist culture that indulges in all sorts of heathen infidel activity including 'sins of the flesh', and who are exporting that to (imposing it on, spreading it like a filthy disease) the rest of the world, turning the heads of impressionable young Muslims with liberalism, education and opportunity, then bombing Hollywood, as suggested by Janeane, would not be nearly so effectively hurtful as, say, attacking the World Trade Center and the Pentagon.

Richard Dawkins introduced the idea that it is, in fact, religion, that motivates extremist Muslims to want to attack the West, due to their belief that the people of the West are infidels. This is the rub, I think. Without that sense of dogmatic, righteous, elitist, divine religious purpose (death to infidels), people would not be using it to justify committing acts of atrocity.

[Chinaski]

Garofalo was blinded by political correctness. "How dare we suggest that the fault lies within different cultures! Different cultures are inherently good, because they're different! It's got to be America's fault!"

Bah.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Only listened once so far, but I liked how Friedman put things.

And THE QUOTE: "There is plenty of variation in brain power, all the way from Einstein on the one hand to Sarah Palin on the other."

[Sisifo]

Just posted this in the related thread over at RDF ... fits here, too ...


Janeane Garofalo was quite set on the idea that America and its foreign policy is responsible for causing Muslims to commit acts of terrorism. She's obviously either forgotten or unaware of the 2002 Muslim terrorist bombings of a Bali tourist nightclub district, killing 202 locals and international visitors, and injuring 240.

Bill Maher was talking about a form of guilt based hypocrisy (he flippantly, and rather insensitively, described as 'schizophrenia', but that's a different matter) whereby Muslims living in America indulge in all the freely available things the West has to offer, feel guilty for their decadence and turn that guilt into some sort of twisted combination of denial and vengeance, attacking the source of the temptation. Bill specifically named the kinds of temptation he was refering to and I'll say those are things Muslims would regard as 'sins of the flesh'.

Janeane argued that, no, it's foreign policy that is attracting Muslim extremist's attention, and cited the World Trade centre attack as her evidence, dismissing Western 'sins of the flesh' style temptation as not a plausible reason for terrorist attack because other more decadent cultures aren't attracting the attention of the terrorists. That's wrong. Bali's tourist nightclub district was attacked by Muslim terrorists for that very reason: decadent indulgence in 'sins of the flesh'.

If organised terrorists want to really hurt a big, arrogant, decadent, greedy, capitalist culture that indulges in all sorts of heathen infidel activity including 'sins of the flesh', and who are exporting that to (imposing it on, spreading it like a filthy disease) the rest of the world, turning the heads of impressionable young Muslims with liberalism, education and opportunity, then bombing Hollywood, as suggested by Janeane, would not be nearly so effectively hurtful as, say, attacking the World Trade Center and the Pentagon.

Richard Dawkins introduced the idea that it is, in fact, religion, that motivates extremist Muslims to want to attack the West, due to their belief that the people of the West are infidels. This is the rub, I think. Without that sense of dogmatic, righteous, elitist, divine religious purpose (death to infidels), people would not be using it to justify committing acts of atrocity.

I don't agree with your reading of the 2002 Bali bombing. The Bali bombing was an in-region terrorist group who targets specifically westerns and the current governments in SE Asia's countries with significant Islamic population.
As targeting westerns and trying to hit government interests/policies, they have targeted often tourist spots (Bali in 2002 and 2005, but also Jakarta, and they were stopped in Singapore). As said, the goal was the biggest economic impact and western casualties as possible. The fact that it was a pub of "flesh sin", was incidental.
There are similar but less organized issues in Egypt, Jordan, and other touristic Muslim countries.

I personally believe that they are mistaking the knife with the hitman and with the murderer.

Fanatical belief is a tool, holiness and moral rectitude is the way to use that tool. But the motive of these crimes is IMO a reaction to the cornering of Arab countries in the World's current structure. Call that structure American FFAA policy, or whatever.

Obviously, if they didn't hold stupid beliefs, they would be a lot less stupidy-ables in the first place, but that's argumentative. In the end, to think how long has Islam been around, and when does Islamic terrorism start, makes the motives quite clear.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Just a point here. IIRC, the Bali night club was frequented by Aussie tourists, and that is considered to be the reason it was targeted. Or am I mis-remembering?

[RPizzle]

Dawkins was far too polite. He seemed in the background the entire time, with a quip now and then.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Dawkins was far too polite. He seemed in the background the entire time, with a quip now and then.

Yeah, that's the problem with flogging a book. You get stuck in situations where the host doesn't want to talk about your book, but to rant on his own agenda. Still, more people know the new book is out there now.