U.K. is not a synonym of England

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Red Celt
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U.K. is not a synonym of England

Post by Red Celt » Sun Nov 04, 2012 11:00 am

As you might have noticed (from some of my comments) one of my bugbears (and I admit that I have quite a few) is the perverse naming of sections of the British Isles. I have noticed (over the course of my lifetime) that these "confusions" have worsened, not improved... with some exceptions. Over 300 years have passed since the Act of Union, but that union remains a bit of a head-scratcher for some. In my youth, I would watch the England football team being cheered-on by supporters who (almost universally) waved union flags... as if that flag represented only England. This was especially humourous when England were playing against Scotland, Wales or Northern Ireland. Unless they were all unrepentantly unbiased and were supporting both teams on the pitch. I suspect not.

This misunderstanding also exists in other countries and such people can be forgiven for that misunderstanding, given that it is shared by some of the residents of England.

But anyway, here's an image to help explain it.

One bugbear at a time... :)

Image
Image

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Re: U.K. is not a synonym of England

Post by devogue » Sun Nov 04, 2012 11:03 am

To be honest, it never bothered me in the slightest.

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Re: U.K. is not a synonym of England

Post by Cormac » Sun Nov 04, 2012 11:08 am

Brain malfunction deleted.

Confusion between UK and GB& NI cleared up.
Last edited by Cormac on Sun Nov 04, 2012 11:11 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: U.K. is not a synonym of England

Post by Red Celt » Sun Nov 04, 2012 11:10 am

Cormac wrote:The map on the left is not the UK. the bit in dark blue is not the UK. The UK is part of it.
UK is shorthand for The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. The map is fine. ;)
Image

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Re: U.K. is not a synonym of England

Post by Gawdzilla Sama » Sun Nov 04, 2012 11:12 am

Red Celt wrote:
Cormac wrote:The map on the left is not the UK. the bit in dark blue is not the UK. The UK is part of it.
UK is shorthand for The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. The map is fine. ;)
The Brutish Empire, on the other paw, was briefly a bit larger.
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Re: U.K. is not a synonym of England

Post by Cormac » Sun Nov 04, 2012 11:14 am

Red Celt wrote:
Cormac wrote:The map on the left is not the UK. the bit in dark blue is not the UK. The UK is part of it.
UK is shorthand for The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. The map is fine. ;)

Damn. I wasn't fast enough to cover the tracks of my stupidity.
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Re: U.K. is not a synonym of England

Post by Red Celt » Sun Nov 04, 2012 11:17 am

Gawdzilla Sama wrote:
Red Celt wrote:
Cormac wrote:The map on the left is not the UK. the bit in dark blue is not the UK. The UK is part of it.
UK is shorthand for The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. The map is fine. ;)
The Brutish Empire, on the other paw, was briefly a bit larger.
All empires are brutish, else they'd have trouble becoming empires.

:prof:

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Image

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Re: U.K. is not a synonym of England

Post by Red Celt » Sun Nov 04, 2012 11:19 am

Cormac wrote:
Red Celt wrote:
Cormac wrote:The map on the left is not the UK. the bit in dark blue is not the UK. The UK is part of it.
UK is shorthand for The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. The map is fine. ;)

Damn. I wasn't fast enough to cover the tracks of my stupidity.
Sorry, Cormac. Too late to edit it, now. Just do what I do at this time of day and blame it on a lack of coffee. Usually works. :coffee:
Image

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Re: U.K. is not a synonym of England

Post by Cormac » Sun Nov 04, 2012 11:21 am

Red Celt wrote:
Cormac wrote:
Red Celt wrote:
Cormac wrote:The map on the left is not the UK. the bit in dark blue is not the UK. The UK is part of it.
UK is shorthand for The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. The map is fine. ;)

Damn. I wasn't fast enough to cover the tracks of my stupidity.
Sorry, Cormac. Too late to edit it, now. Just do what I do at this time of day and blame it on a lack of coffee. Usually works. :coffee:
It is what comes of posting while my two year old and four year old are clambering all over me, with Ben and Holly's Little Kingdom blaring in the background.

:)
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Re: U.K. is not a synonym of England

Post by Gawdzilla Sama » Sun Nov 04, 2012 11:26 am

Red Celt wrote:Image
Yeah, yeah, sure, sure. I for one wouldn't mind seeing all those places to go hell in a handbasket.
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Re: U.K. is not a synonym of England

Post by Red Celt » Sun Nov 04, 2012 11:37 am

Gawdzilla Sama wrote:Yeah, yeah, sure, sure. I for one wouldn't mind seeing all those places to go hell in a handbasket.
I'm guessing that the exact same thing would have been said by some Brits during the height of empire.

What a state does and what the citizens of that state want... not always the same thing. Not even in a democracy, when the only candidates on the ballot paper believe the opposite of your beliefs. This is similar to conversations I've been involved in on some July 4ths... as if it was an entirely "you versus us" mentality. It very much wasn't. Many vocal (British) thinkers at the time were very much in favour of U.S. independence.

States and citizenry... not always a happy marriage.
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Re: U.K. is not a synonym of England

Post by Jesus_of_Nazareth » Sun Nov 04, 2012 11:40 am

Techincally you are correct - but in practice you are wrong.

The UK was simply an artificial construct of the English to save using the word Colony in regard to the countries it conquered and were unable to assimilate (or simply did not want to!) - indeed, for many years after the Union the UK was known as.......England.

In the pic on the right, England looks a bit lonely.........
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Re: U.K. is not a synonym of England

Post by Svartalf » Sun Nov 04, 2012 11:41 am

Why did you include Cornwall in England? that's silly. Devon, I'm not sure of, Cornwall still has its own identity.
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Re: U.K. is not a synonym of England

Post by Gawdzilla Sama » Sun Nov 04, 2012 11:44 am

Red Celt wrote:
Gawdzilla Sama wrote:Yeah, yeah, sure, sure. I for one wouldn't mind seeing all those places to go hell in a handbasket.
I'm guessing that the exact same thing would have been said by some Brits during the height of empire.

What a state does and what the citizens of that state want... not always the same thing. Not even in a democracy, when the only candidates on the ballot paper believe the opposite of your beliefs. This is similar to conversations I've been involved in on some July 4ths... as if it was an entirely "you versus us" mentality. It very much wasn't. Many vocal (British) thinkers at the time were very much in favour of U.S. independence.

States and citizenry... not always a happy marriage.
How many of those US troops are occupation forces? How many countries have heads of state directly appointed by our Queen President. How many of them have stars on the US flags?

Basing troops in a country is not the same as making that country a part of your empire. Otherwise we could claim Oz, Canada, and England in our empire.
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Re: U.K. is not a synonym of England

Post by Svartalf » Sun Nov 04, 2012 11:47 am

BTW, does that map include only actual military presence, or does it count the squad of Marines in every embassy as "military presence"?
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